Reason #46 why you don't see me duct taped to a peer.....

[gurdymonkey]

The "Look What My Apprentice Did" post has hit two of my LJ groups today.

I went back and read the thing twice and you know what? She never told us her apprentice's name! Why? I mean, really. Why?????

This is yet another of the anarchistic reasons - and I have many - why I have never entered into a formal relationship with an SCA peer.

My work (or current lack thereof) reflects upon ME, thank you very much. I have earned renown of a sort without needing an advocate.

So no one gets to brag about me.

Then again, no one gets to complain to their cronies that I'm not living up to their expectations. Why should I live up to someone else's expectations? Isn't this MY hobby?

Pardon me while I go poke a laurel in the eye with a sharp stick.

Comments

[oonaghsown.livejournal.com]

OK so poke me in the eye with a stick if you must.

I was excited to show off my apprentice's work, with her permision, to anyone interested. In that excitment I forgot to send through her name. Thank you for pointing this out.

Lolly (that's her name) asked me to be an apprentice some years ago. We are both happy with our arrangement.

Being an apprentice to me means that the SCA is way down on your list of priorities. Way after family, work, education, friends ... and so on, SCA pretty much at the bottom.

I do SCA to please myself only. I expect the same of my apprentices. They should only do it for their pleasure. Being my apprentice is not a chore, or a way for them to gain social standing. These people are first and foremost my friends.

I am happy for you that you feel no need to be duct taped to a peer. My friends are certainly not duct taped to me. They are all, intellegent, opinionated, wonderful women, and I am proud to call them my friends first, and that they have enough confidence in me to allow me to call them my apprentices also.

[gurdymonkey.livejournal.com]

I am pleased and relieved to hear all of these things.

Thank you for acknowledging Lady Agneta by name as she deserves.

[sarahbellem.livejournal.com]

The omission of the apprentice's name got to me, too. Definitely an interesting thing to leave off...

[kass-rants.livejournal.com]

*snicker*

[firehauke.livejournal.com]

Yeah, leaving off the apprentice's name is kinda odd.

But all in all, nice outfit, though the pics shouldn't have been taken with her against a brick wall. Just saying.

Agree with you on roped to a peer - I don't want it either. I like getting advice when I ask for it. I know where I'm going and roughly how I'm getting there with my art. That's plenty.

[callistotoni.livejournal.com]

She must have figured it out, because as of 11:00 PM Saturday night she did an "edited to add" addendum with the woman's name and a link to her website.

Beautiful dress, though.

[carbonphoenix.livejournal.com]

I didn't introduce myself last time I left a comment and it occurred to me that I didn't have my user info updated anyway. I'm Aleit. I hang out with Vigdis. I was terribly chilly at an Estrella and you let me borrow your fingerless gloves.

And after the introduction, I wonder how forgetting to name her can be an oversight. Like "ok, so this person made cool stuff. they're my apprentice, everyone must know who they are!" maybe on their personal LJ, yes, but on a list that spans kingdoms? Heh.

[peronel.livejournal.com]

Thank you! I don't know what it is but there's something about the whole laurel/apprentice thing that leaves me feeling slightly queasy. At least in how the relationship is articulated mostly by laurels, which is the only way I've come across it.

I don't know what it is. But the dynamics are icky. If the apprentice was the 'right age' I wouldn't be so bothered, but most of them are grown women, dammit.

So, umm, yeah. I agree.

[bovil.livejournal.com]

Some peers are assholes.

[acanthusleaf.livejournal.com]

Some of everybody are assholes.

[bovil.livejournal.com]

True, definitely true.

its just this kind of attitude that really irritates me

[lorralei.livejournal.com]

Considering this post was about me I thought perhaps I better voice my opinion on this matter.

This was obviously a small oversight by my Laurel and Myself. It didn’t overly bother me that she forgot to post my name etc, as well she rectified it as soon as it was pointed out to her. Also I had given her permission to post this information to lj for me. This is because I recently come to the conclusion that I could not be bothered with the nastyness involved with putting your own work out there. I was well and truly over it.

After some encouragement, I gave permission, there is nothing like the support of FRIENDS to motivate you to feel as if your work is good enough to share.

On the other hand I discover that what was intended as a really lovely gesture and one very excited friend wanting to show people what her FRIEND had done, has been turned into a LAUREL bashing vendetta, by persons with rather large chips on their shoulders.

Quite frankly it leaves a rather dirty taste in ones mouth. When some decides to take something good and warp it into a misguided cynical generalized commentary on peers. If you have a problem with peers… that’s just it it's YOUR problem. If you have had a bad experience that’s YOUR bad experience. GET OVER IT!

Maybe the reason you aren't 'duct taped' to a peer is not yours alone. If you denegrate the efforts of others as freely as you have turned this into something nasty, I'm not surprised.

Re: its just this kind of attitude that really irritates me

[gurdymonkey.livejournal.com]

I am profoundly relieved that the mystery of your identity has been solved, my lady. I am relieved that it has been rectified and that you are receiving credit for your work.

Please go back and re-read what I wrote. I was not denigrating anything. I was, however, questioning an omission that to me seemed, well, wrong. If my actions have had anything to do with your receiving proper recognition for your work by name, I have nothing to apologize for.

Re: its just this kind of attitude that really irritates me

[dezeragoza.livejournal.com]

As Lollies apprentice sister I support her and her work. I am also distressed that some people feel the need to bash a peer simply because they are proud f a friends achievements.

I got just as much praise for my uni results as ofr any SCA thing I achieve, and find the current trend of uncivilized harranging to be utterly distasteful

A persons decision to be attached or not to a peer, is a PERSONAL choice, I have no need to comment on your decisions not to , and I honestly see no need to have comments made on why I did.

Once again lollie I think your dress is wonderful, and how you got it done around uni astounds me ,

Re: its just this kind of attitude that really irritates me

[jo-apostoloff.livejournal.com]

I am one of Oonagh's apprentices... and I don't think you had anything to do with Oonagh giving proper recognition to Lolly's work. Oonagh is a fantastic peer, and her unfailing support is one of the reason's why I am her apprentice.

She doesn't criticise, she teaches and mentors, and she always gives recognition to those that deserve it.

If all peers were like Oonagh, the SCA would be a better place.

Gurdymonkey, If you knew Oonagh as I do, there is no way that you would have posted this thread, and you would have realised it was a slight oversight that she would correct.

I'll go back to my little hole now.

Jo
aka
Lady Antonia Della Scalla
Apprentice to Mistress Oonagh
Squire to Sir Brusi

Re: its just this kind of attitude that really irritates me

[oonaghsown.livejournal.com]

Lolly and I have spoken, she is still very upset by these posts, and wanted me to make some things clear.

She does not want to be a peer. She wants to learn from me some of the things I can teach her. She wants my frindship more than the peer relationship, and so do I.

I agree with the sentiment expressed in your non peer advice.

There are things that are not obvious here.

Firstly, that the post gurdymonkey made was found by her and upset her so much that she phoned me in tears.

Secondly, that I do not presume to have any particular control over my apprentices. They each have their own free wills, and are free to express themselves as they see fit. Her 'yelling' was out of frusteration and hurt at what had been a very posative experience for her.

Thridly, are all, intellegent, opinionated, wonderful women. I stand by them, and their actions and deeds. If I find that I am no longer able to do so as a peer then I would offer them a 'without predjudice' release from our arangement. As a friend, I would discuss such matters.

From your post it seems that you have some a poorly relationship with peers in your neck of the woods. It is unwise to assume that all peers, and/or apprentice/ aurel relationships are the same.

These posts on gurdymonkey's LJ have undone many weeks of encouragement and suport that I and my other apprentices offered Lolly about her work. In convincing her that there are people out there who really were suportive and not uncesessarialy critical.

The suggestion that she now post to dress diaries (not by you) is completely out of the question for her now.

In short the original post and subsiquent responces lifter my friends spirits. This series of posts hurt her. I am sorely disapointed for her and upset that this has happened.

Re: its just this kind of attitude that really irritates me

[ayeshadream.livejournal.com]

That is truly sad, and she is truly talented.

I hope that eventually this hurt can be healed and that she realizes that not everyone is so quick to judge.

I'm getting apprenticed at 12th night, and I'm extreamly excited about it. The reason why I chose the Laurel I did, is because we're great friends- and that weighed at least much if not more than all the things I can learn from her.

[kass-rants.livejournal.com]

I'm torn. As you know, I played that game. Played it and had my Laurel not stick up for me when I was being defamed. So I have a rather low opinion of Peers.

(That's not to say I don't know some great people who are Peers. I just don't trust them when they become *my* Peer, if that makes any sense.)

But the thing that bugs me most about this whole thing is "Look at the FABULOUS job my apprentice has done!" thing and how she posts it all over the internet. Ick! I'd feel so dirty...

Now don't get me wrong: I'm all for putting myself forward. And I love when people post my stuff and talk about how great it is. But this just feels... icky.

I found myself looking for any flaw I could exploit. I wanted to find fault with it and scorn it. And I'm not normally like that.

[danabren.livejournal.com]

CHRIST! MY EYE! WHAT'D YOU DO THAT FOR?

owowowowowwww

[gurdymonkey.livejournal.com]

No, NOT you. Even if you insist on knitting while in itsutsugini. (Sigh....)

[danabren.livejournal.com]

I brag about you, so nyah. I just can't take credit for anything except knowing Kass who allowed me to renew our acquaintance.

So nyah, again :)

(MY EYE!)

[gurdymonkey.livejournal.com]

Ack! I misspelled "itsutsuginu." Most unbragworthy.

So phtttttttttttttt!

Irrelevant observations "R

[minstrlmummr.livejournal.com]

I know nothing about "itsutsuginu" but once you mentioned it, the word "itsutsugini" looks like the name of some Japanese pasta dish with eel and seaweed
or something.

Re: Irrelevant observations "R

[gurdymonkey.livejournal.com]

Kindly get out of my head, it's crowded enough in here.

How does this sound?

Udon (noodles), plus eel, quail egg, sea urchin, bonito and a slice of kamaboko (fish cake).

("Itsutsuginu" refers to five robes worn in layers.)

Re: Irrelevant observations "R

[takadai-no-tora.livejournal.com]

Leave out the sea urchin and it sounds very good!